Here Torrance is speaking of John’s accounting of the Word made flesh:
. . . In its prologue it speaks of the Word made flesh, and that light sets the whole gospel as the revelation and reconciliation of God in Christ, but it then moves on from the prologue to speak all through of the Son in his obedience to the Father and in his fulfilment of the role of the servant. That belongs to the very nature of the case, for the incarnation of the Word means an incarnation in which the Word is not simply addressed to man from without but so enters into human existence that it becomes a word that is heard and appropriated by man, and a word that is answered for man by this man in the whole course of his obedient life. Thus within the incarnation, the Son is the fuller category, for the Son hears the word of the Father, and the son answers the Father by word and life, and the revelation mediated through the Son is the reveltion of the word (logos) which he has received from the Father and now speaks in the language (lalia)of man. Of all the books of the New Testament none more than the fourth Gospel presents Christ as the servant-Son obedient in everything to the Father, doing only those things that please him, and from beginning to end fulfilling his will. It is thus that he the Son declares, ‘exegetes’ the Father, and reveals him to and within human life on earth and in history. (Thomas F. Torrance, “Incarnation,” 67-68)
What a great Christmas truth! Our knowledge of God comes from within God’s life in Christ for us. This quote illustrates the importance of vicariousness, and how that coinheres with what Christ as mediator is all about. The incarnation is such a profound thing, that even the manger and its “hiddeness” become a vehicle for displaying the glory of God that culminates in the cross for us.
Merry Christmas!
Great quote! And have a very happy Christmas Bobby – you and the family.Every blessing in Jesus,Glen
The more i read and re-read the quote, the less i felt i understood it. I quote: for the Son hears the word of the Father by word and life, etc etc. [and earlier on] becomes a word that is appropriated by man ….i think, in response, that Christ is more special a man than i had thereto thought of. That is to say, we can no longer – in the light of this Torrance piece – imagine that we have by our own hearing, the ability to do the will of God, like Christ does, in the accomplishment of the will of his Father. Is it surprising then that man – us fallen men and women – are as empty and fragile and as in need of Christ, if it is only via Christ and his Spirit, that the word is (obliquely ie. not directly, as for Christ) available to us. No wonder we fail and misunderstand and mess things up! Up to a certain point, i thought that all Christians had to do – as the caricature goes – was to read and decipher the text of the bible to do the will of God. Things are not what they appear to be. If Christ and his humanity does indeed occupy a special position in the communication between Father and Son, then can we folk ever expect the fruitfulness or effectiveness that characterizes the life Christ on earth led? Surely , and it feels like this sometimes, we are like rats in a maze trying to find our way, as in the dark. But, and this is a big, but, Christ knows this, of his children, of his dependents, and takes pity on us…or somit?
Glen,Thank you, I hope you guys had a wonderful Christmas too!Timothy,Hello. Alot in your comment. Let me just say that thankfully our standing before the Father is in Christ both objectively and subjectively. We are growing in the subjective side of that by the Spirit; so that our 'sanctification' will be fully realized at that moment that 'we will look like Jesus, because we will see Him as He is' (cf. I Jn 3). Our aim is to be perfect, as Paul said, or to be imitators of God; but of course all of this is grounded in Christ's humanity for us (His vicarious and perfect life before the Father by the Spirit). Thankfully we haven't been left as orphans, so while we screw up; we end up still looking like Jesus in the end (and hopefully quite frequently, now, in increasing ways II Cor 3:18). Hope that helps.
Thanks then, Bobby. Well all i can conclude is that our being in Christ means that there is an aweful lot more going on, by way of the activity of the Spirit, in our lives, than we may even be aware of. 'Protestant' culture and our literate culture in general, likes to be able to put labels or words on what is going on, by way of our transformation or onto likeness of Christ, but I am beginning to doubt that we can really describe that. What more, in the circumstances can we do than, simply say, and confess to Him, Lord, I look away from myself, towards you. Why? Because you are the author and finisher (perfector) of my faith. ?? I think too, Jesus is sweet enough not to remind us of all the pain or troubles we will face ahead. Does my whingeing do any good? Maybe if it turns me about, to look to Christ. Not everyone has had a marvellous Christmas and i am/he is, with them too, still, and hopefully as you say to the end.
Timothy,Yes, I think if we have a theology of, as you say: "I look away from mysel, towards you;" that we have a sound way forward, and fruitful way forward in terms of knowing God in Christ.Thanks for sharing!
Bobby, This whole string here which began with the Torrance – and I have read lots of his writings in the past – has made me realise just how far adrift i had become. I never really did live by the Grace of God in Christ alone. Why, because I fell subtly, but devastatingly, under the influence of a bit of pietism and a bit of pelagianism. Yes, more pelgagianism than I would care to admit! I am or rather with the help of the Spirit, no doubt, rediscovering the meaning of the Grace of God and i am having to put away my self-will and it feels strange relying upon the Grace of God alone, but that is the only Goodness we have to rely upon, ultimately. This makes the faith we believe in very 'other worldy', very deep, surprise , surprise , thus making Grace itself of God, and not a little difficult for us humans, to learn how to live with! Maybe now that i have said this, my earlier postings are easier to follow as, largely, so many questions relating to the dead end of Pelagianism. Now I can see that we , throwing ourselves upon Christ, and depending totally upon his SPirit, that we have no easy answers in life, no easy to follow blueprint and that Theology never could/did aim to make life, in this way, an easy path to follow…..Thanks a lot to you.
I hope you will not mind me saying but my above posting is the most important blog post I feel i have ever made. I also, had somehow managed to de-divinise the Gospel making Christ so familar as in merely a human figure, that as James A Fowler has written, I had made being a Christian synomynous, somewhow, ie by imitation, with Jesus Christ! So there is probably multiple heresies, going on here! At any rate, I had totally, unbeknowst to myself, stripped out of the Gospel accounts, all the unique and uniquely difficult, ie from the merely human perspective, the account or life of God as man for God, as it where. As far as the life of God in us goes, herein lies the difficulty, so far as we live in an age of instant gratification/control. There is no technology to control God! To throw oneself, in such a way, upon the mercy or Grace of God, well, makes me feel as if I am a person out of time, not a person of modern sensibilities at all!
Timothy,This is a constant battle, isn't it? Thanks for sharing more of your background, that helps me know where you're coming from a bit more. If we have a theological construct that is grounded in Christ/Trinity, methodologically, then I think we are on good footing to avoid model's of Christianity that slip back to the natural Pelagian bent.Thanks for sharing!